It's all about motives, and it's all about the core fear. It has nothing to do with the behaviors that they're showing you. So if you just strictly go off the behaviors you're seeing in your home team or in the work team, you're gonna miss the mark every time and you're gonna get it wrong, and that's when this ineffective leadership and guidance starts to kick in.
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Welcome back to the show. Today, I am thrilled to have Tracy O'Malley with me. Tracy is an Enneagram expert and leadership and communication and culture expert working with individuals, small businesses, corporate clients, anybody who wants to dive into how to become a better leader and have more fulfillment in their lives.
As an Enneagram expert, Tracy helps people leverage their natural strengths and understand their stressors to achieve unstoppable success using the power of the Enneagram. Along with her work as a consultant and coach, she's a multimillionaire entrepreneur, a coveted speaker, and the host of the Top podcast lead with the Enneagram guiding people with actionable frameworks to rewire limiting beliefs.
So Tracy and I met at an event that she was speaking at and then again at an event where she was speaking at a mastermind I was in. And anybody who has met Tracy will say the same. When you meet her, you are instantly captivated. She can literally see inside your soul, and I know I'm not the only one who said this.
And working with Tracy to understand my own Enneagram type, I felt like, oh my God, I completely. Finally understood myself. I understood my, not only relationship with myself, but relationship with others and feeling like, well, okay, I need to know more of this. We immediately did a partner session with my husband and I to understand how each of our Enneagram types impacted, you know, our relationship and how we can better understand each other and how we can parent better.
And it was so clear for me how powerful this work is for teams and leaders and companies so that people can better understand really in any partnership that you're in. And this is something that Tracy talks a lot about on her podcast. With that said, I am so excited to have Tracy with me today to talk about the magic and transformational power of the Enneagram.
Whether you're an executive, whether you're a manager in the corporate world, running a small business entrepreneur, this applies to you. So Tracy, welcome to the show. Hi, so happy to be on. Hi. Let's dive in with setting a baseline for folks. If you've never heard about the Enneagram or what it is, what is the Enneagram and, and how do people kind of understand it?
Depending on who you ask, you'll get all sorts of different answers. You know, if you Google it, it's like this archetypal framework for personality and true it is that I am kind of a bottom line. Me what's in this for me. Person. And so I like to explain it in that way, and I know you have a very specific type of listener.
And what the Enneagram is to me is this framework that allows me to understand not just myself better, but other people better with compassion, with empathy, with grace, with service, with understanding, to create a win-win for everyone. You know, when we have all these different life experiences and perspectives, if we are just locked into what ours is, we kind of miss the boat on leadership, whether it's in our home or in business.
So when I learned about the Enneagram, I was at a place in my life where on paper it looked really okay, but I knew like I was missing the mark home. I was missing the mark in my own soul fulfillment. And when I was learning about this, I, I had all these aha moments of understanding where I'm really strong.
Where I get tripped up and then also understanding that I am who I am and I have a responsibility for the come from. Right? Like what are my superpowers? Are my superpowers, but only when the come from is that love, compassion, empathy, service, and grace. The same things that are my very superpowers absolutely are the kryptonite in my life.
Mm-hmm. And, and quite honestly, took my life in a lot of ways to ground zero when they were coming from fear and security and worthiness, shame, guilt, or ego. So when I had this framework and understanding that this is who I am. But I have to work on the come from and the level of health that I'm operating at, and the Enneagram really allows you to get back into more of your intuition, your body, and use that beautiful superpower that is your personality.
Now, within that framework, I had this big realization like, oh, you mean not everyone is motivated like me. Not everyone is. Yes, fearful like me, and the first place I recognized that was in my home. I have two kids that are in their mid twenties at this point. They were teenagers at the time, and I realized that I only spoke in a way that.
Would work for them if they were motivated like me, and if they feared like me. And I knew that they weren't. And so this framework, the nine archetypes in the the Enneagram, allowed me to create eight other different languages for people that aren't like me, that are motivated differently than me, not only to communicate better.
With them. But I also learned a hell of a lot more about different perspectives, different experiences, different strengths along the way. But my first realization in that 11 years ago when I was introduced to this, was within my own home team. Mm-hmm. And I was like, wow. No wonder, no matter how well intended I was.
In my home and in the workplace. I was looking at other places that no matter how well intended I was, it wasn't landing the way I would've liked it to for them. I wasn't very effective in the ways that I wanted to be. And so with this archetype framework, I went home with this and I started testing it out and overnight things changed in my home.
Just speaking their language, I was able to recognize, you know, the language of my children and they're not just different from me, they're different from each other as well. And I was like, oh my goodness. But having that nine different kind of languages that, the basics that people are operating from, when you can learn that things change overnight, yes, things change overnight.
But here's the deal with the Enneagram, you know, it's not just this plug and play. Take a quiz, here you go. System. There's more complexities to that. And the first five years I was using it, I was telling no one using no assessments, but I kind of was able to. Use these nine different buckets and actually three different buckets, if I'm being really honest, to be able to understand where people's main motives and fears were.
Yeah, so that's kind of the, the why you need to understand the Enneagram kind of definition of it. But if you Google it, it's this ancient archetypal system. Basically. Yeah. Well, and why I love it so much is, I mean, what you talked about touches on so many of the things I hear from leaders, both in the corporate world and as entrepreneurs.
Questions like, why is no one listening to me? I told them what I wanted. Why is it not happening? Mm-hmm. Why are things moving so slow? And I think it's a lack of understanding that, yeah, not everybody's motivated by me. Not everybody hears things in the same way, and I think it's a. Especially true with entrepreneurs that, you know, they, they start a business cuz they're very excited, they're bought in, they know how to make money, they're their masters of their trade and then they hire a team.
Mm-hmm. And they see, well, not everybody's excited about this vision as me, what's happening. Right. And stuff can really go awry. And it can create a lot of tension on a team. It can create a lot of misunderstandings. And so, I mean, I can see just by what you're saying, with applying that home team example to a team at work, why it's so critical.
Sure. Yeah. And a lot of times, You know, when we're hiring, we'll sometimes hire people that we like or who are like us. Yeah. And although personality-wise, that works really well as far as getting the task done and filling the gaps where you're not strong, you're gonna miss the mark. And you'll have these expectations that, well, you hired the person that you liked.
That is like you expecting them to have different strengths as you, and so you miss the mark there. Or you do fill the gaps with people that are able to have the different strengths that you are, but because you don't understand what motivates them or where their fears are at. There's this personality conflict, even though the job might get done.
So, you know, there's both sides of the coin that I see in the hiring and filling the team process. So, you know, ideally you do want to fill the team with the person that has different strengths than you, but then you're gonna have to have a radical, compassionate understanding of how they operate in order to more effectively lead them.
And also everybody creates a win-win situation. Yeah, for sure. Absolutely. And I think in the corporate world with things like quiet, quitting, great resignation, we're starting to see people aren't motivated by the things that we used to think, and we're gonna have to have a new language for interacting.
And what's awesome about the in room is if you understand your team members' motivations and fears as you called out. Well, you can speak directly to that thing. You can create a stronger sense of purpose. You can create more meaning in their work. And I always say, you know, you don't have to be, you know, on the mission of the moon to have a meaning and purpose in your, in your company, in your work.
No. But you have to understand what is it for that person. So this is such a powerful tool for managers to connect those dots for their team members. Well, the other thing it also creates, aside from what you said, is credibility and trust. Yeah. You know, when the reason that, when you were explaining how people feel when they're with me, It can feel very exposing cuz I can see right through you.
But it also creates the safety factor. Yeah. And also that credibility factor. Like she actually cares. What motivates me, she actually cares who I am. And in the culture that we're in, in the world right now, that goes a lot longer way than even money. Yeah. Or you know, a work schedule, like people want to be fulfilled, they want to feel lit up, and they want an opportunity for growth and.
When you're in an environment where the person in charge or the person leading you doesn't see you for who you are, it's why we are getting the quiet, quitting and like PE people are like, peace out. I'll figure this out on my own. Yeah, and so that credibility and trust factor now more than ever as a leader, Is so vital.
Yeah, so vital. More than ever. Yeah, absolutely. And now we're talking, you know, new generations entering the workforce. Yeah. Who are explicitly, they're saying, I need to feel a sense of purpose. I need to feel like this work matters. I need to feel like I matter. And again, with incentives changing and motivations changing, this is now a tool that you can use to understand what may feel like.
I don't understand anything that motivates this generation Well, yeah. Give it a try because people, you know, if you demonstrate that empathy and slow down and say, well, you know, I need to build the skill as a manager, as a leader, to finally start to understand really what's going on with my team members, that just assigning work that isn't gonna happen.
Saying, here, do this and I'll pay you more isn't gonna work. No, there's gotta be something else. Well, and I'm raising this generation Yeah. Of workforce and a lot of times I think, You know, I'm a Gen Xer. A lot of times we just scrap it up to this generation. They don't understand they're entitled, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
And although there might be some of that going on, obviously, I think the more that you don't lump them into a category of a generation and instead take the time to understand what motivat, I work with a lot of 20 somethings I'm telling you right now. It isn't just that they're this generation, right.
It's because they want to, we have a generation in the workforce that has self-awareness. They were born into these kind of tools where, you know, I'm a first generation personal developer and you know, the more that I dive into self-awareness tools, not just for myself but everybody else in the world, it's not lost on me.
The reason why I work with a lot of 20 somethings. Mm-hmm. Because they do appreciate. And respect the wisdom that I do bring to the table. And they also appreciate the fact that I want to understand them at a soul level, not just a Gen Z level. Yeah, right. So if you are a leader, you know, I'm gonna tell you right now, if you start lumping 'em into that generation, you're going to lose.
Beautiful, beautiful people that I'm telling you right now, that generation is here to teach us all a little bit of something and, and it's this win-win factor when you, you come to the table respecting that they do have an element and understanding that maybe your experience doesn't have, but your willingness to understand them at that level will.
Take the team a lot further faster. Yeah, absolutely. And this point of not lumping people together and making generalizations about mm-hmm. Generation or whatever, this is something I talk a lot about when it comes to delivering feedback, saying, oh, you know, like you said, this generation can't handle feedback or does this, or doesn't do this.
And when we make that assumption and, and bias, essentially we're cutting people off from actually seeing, you know, what actually is their full potential as you called out. A hundred percent. And so with, um, I think Enneagram is, as we talk about it, what a powerful tool for being able to deliver effective feedback.
Yeah. Because if you don't land feedback in the language that that person understands, it's gonna go over their head, including with positive feedback and recognition. A hundred percent. Like I am somebody who does not love recognition for a lot of reasons. And there are understanding why that is would go a lot further because when people know how to give me positive feedback and they do it in a way that lights me up, I, the trust, the credibility goes a lot further.
And knowing the dynamics, like having two children in, you know, the twenties, like how I deliver a message to one, I have to be very mindful. Not necessarily of the message, but the tone and the timing. The other one, I don't have to necessarily worry about the tone and the timing, but I have to be very mindfully crafting the language I use.
Yeah, right. Really, really important information, whether it's positive feedback or the not so positive feedback. Yeah, absolutely. And the more we understand what motivates people, again, the more specific we can be. And I think this is again where when I learned my type Yeah, which is a three achiever, I was like, wait a second, not everybody is like, you know, motivated to get something done faster or be the first or be the best or, and that learning that I found, it was funny.
We were in a group with a lot of other folks who had different sort of appreciations of learning their types. Some wanted, some liked the one, they had some others I felt like. Oh my gosh. This literally explains everything and I can actually slow down a little bit. Yeah. That this is not something, I mean, it was like I had permission to not be on this hamster wheel.
Uh, what's the next thing? What's the next thing, right? That you know, this like more is better thing. It didn't serve me in the corporate world. It wasn't serving me as an entrepreneur, but I was stuck on that hamster wheel and I figured, well, this is all that's there for me. Well, you had the receipts to show that, right?
That worked out okay for you. And although we have evidence, like I have evidence that my intense. Radical. You know, directness has proved to be pretty effective in a lot of ways. The older you get, you know, got us here, won't necessarily get us there the most effectively as we would like. And the older you get, the less energy reserves you have.
So you have to work smarter, not harder. The other thing I wanted to say before, I know there's gonna be somebody like me listening right now, they're like, yeah, well we're talking about not lumping people into these categories, but here you are with the Enneagram with. These nine little labels that you wanna put on people and, and that's not true.
It's like I said, it's just a framework and we're a lot more than just our type. Right? As you learned and understood, like, yes, you are a three, you're motivated like a three, you're fearful like a three. But there are these other components attached to your framework that are tools that allow you to be a shining example of that motive and that fear.
Right? So I wanted to say that before, yes. Anybody was saying, well, We're, we're not talking about labeling people, but here you are with this personality labeling system. It's way more than that. It's way, way more than that for sure. Yeah, absolutely. And I think that's where I really fell in love with the framework was understanding the different pieces.
How, you know, I think one aspect that was really helpful for my husband and I was understanding, you know, where we're kind of. Are we seeing things through the lens of understanding it through the past, the present, or the future? Yes. And what a difference that makes when you understand if someone is like, for me, I'm thinking about things.
Well, this is how it was before. It's always like a past. My husband's really in the present and there's disconnects just right there. So thinking about your own team, if you are trying to get a team really energized and you're only focused on. No, the past, here's what we tried. This is why it didn't work, and you're trying to motivate a whole bunch of people that are either in the present or in the future.
They're like, well, why is this person stuck? Always talking about like what happened? And it can alienate them from you. It can be confusing. It can create a lot of miscommunication. Oh, totally. When I think about myself, Because I'm present, like what is happening right now person. That's where I go to by default.
And obviously the more emotionally intelligent and the better critical thinker we become, we can move through these centers of intelligence of the past, the future, and the now. As a now thinker and what's happening right now, I have a son that's a past thinker like you and I have a daughter who's more future thinker.
And when they're upset. Right. My son can get stuck in the past and I can be kind of even energetically, even if I'm not verbally judging, I'm like, well, Jesus, well what can you control right now? Yeah. Or when my daughter is on a tangent of worry about the future, I'm like, well, that hasn't even happened yet.
And you know, knowing that about myself, I can be mindful of not being insensitive when I can recognize when I have somebody like you who is going to the past and I can gently guide you into Okay. I understand that that has happened before, and that might create some fear and even some shame, right? Yeah.
Or even some closed-mindedness that that's the way it has to be Now, here's what's happening now and here's what's happening in the future. Again, you know, understanding that this is just framework and it's a tool that you can help guide people through the difference. You're absolutely gonna be wired different.
And that doesn't necessarily mean it's the only right way. Right? Yeah. Yeah. And, and using that, and I love that you used you and Wes as an example cuz Yeah. I'm in a relationship where I have a past thinker too, and I have to bite my tongue sometimes. Like, oh my goodness. Like, but what is happening? Right.
You're gonna miss a miracle right here, right now. Right? Yeah. Absolutely. And so now as teams are going through so much change mm-hmm. So much uncertainty, it's probably triggering all these different things across. So if, you know, if, if the Engram really highlights the fears and motivations, all the fears are lighting up and firing on, on high alert right now.
Yeah, for sure. And so what I'll usually tell people with the Enneagram, because there's all these, if you Googled the Enneagram, you're gonna find all these online quizzes and they're all crap. I'm just gonna tell you right now, they're wrong. 65 to 70% of the time. And so honestly, the first five years I was using this tool, I wasn't using assessments.
I now have an assessment. So for those of you listening, wanting to use something like this for your teams, I have a really robust one that gives you accurate results. If you want to use this kind of framework and you wanna know for sure, which I do highly recommend, it's like accelerates the transformation in your teams.
Yes. Like. Rapid pace, like light years. But one of the things that I will recommend to people when you're first starting out, whether it's just figuring out the people in your life, like please don't go around telling people what you think they are. Like, please do not do that. But one of the things that I did the first five years is what you just talked about, referencing those three centers of intelligence, right?
And this will get you so much further, faster. Because within the nine different Enneagram types, they're lumped into these three different centers of intelligence. And when we bypass out of our intuition and our nervous system and our body, we default into our personality. And wherever your core Enneagram type falls is where you default to in that center of intelligence.
So the two threes and fours, They're driven by significance, their motivator, significance, how that looks for all three is very, very different. And how they fear is very, very different. But still the main motivator is significance. And they are past thinkers. What has happened when things are happening, good or not so good?
They go into the reference bank of what has happened before, just like you said, Lia, right? And so when I was. First in using this tool and my main goal was finding out what center of intelligence they fell into. And so I got really curious and definitely what wanted to know what motivated them. Now, if you are a five, six or seven, you default into the thinking center of intelligence and they are what could happen.
Right where the two threes and fours are feelers and what has happened, the five, six and sevens go into what could happen, so visionaries and all motivated by a need for certainty. Everything they do has a method to their madness to get some kind of certainty. Now, how that looks for a five, six, and seven completely different and how that fear and anxiety manifests also looks very, very different.
But again, Certainty is the main motivator. And when their future thinking, that could create fear and anxiety, like I said. But always what could happen? What could happen? What could happen. Yeah. And then in the eights, nines, and ones where I fall, all three of those types are motivated by a form of independence, autonomy, and control.
Not significance. Not certainty. So when you're like dangling a significance carrot. Yeah. For an eight, nine, or one, it's not gonna work. Oh my God, you could win this. I'm like, I don't care. Does give me independence? Okay, then maybe I'm in. Yeah. But those three go into what is happening right now. We don't always think to the past right away.
We don't always think to the future right away, but we're more in the moment what is happening right now. And the underlying emotion for those when we don't have independence and autonomy and control is a form of anger. Now how that looks for eights, nines, and ones could not be more different. And same thing how they go about getting independence and autonomy and control.
Very, very different. But if you just. Really start to get curious when you're talking to people, whether it's an interview, a teammate, your spouse, your partner, your child, the person back in your groceries at the grocery store, like getting really good at at mastering question, asking to try and figure out what center of intelligence they fall into.
When you land, you'll know it. When you land, you'll know it. And that first five years I was using this tools, like I said, I wasn't using an assessment. And if I could understand if they were either motivated by significance, certainty, Or that independence and autonomy and control. I was able to speak to that a lot faster.
And then once you kind of land there, then you can start kind of figuring out which of the three types within there. Yeah. But it's all about motives and it's all about the core fear. It has nothing to do with the behaviors that they're showing you. So if you just strictly go off the behaviors you're seeing in your home team or in the work team, you're gonna miss the mark every time and you're gonna get it wrong.
And that's when this ineffective leadership and guidance starts to kick in. Yeah. I love that distinction because I think that's when we're stressed as a leader. Yeah. We start going and looking at, well, here's what I'm seeing, and we're not being present. No. And whatever center of intelligence you're in, we have to be present when we're interacting with people and we have to be tuning into, yeah.
More than what people are saying. We have to tune into the body language. Our people that we're really engaged now, they're kind of checked out, are people, you know what's happening right here in. Front of us and, and understanding this about yourself too. Yeah. Yeah. Like when I know, like I'm in a period right now where I'm going through a major transition in my life.
Like probably the biggest one I've ever had next to being divorced. And I thank God for this framework because I understand exactly what's happening right now. It doesn't mean that I can automatically just snap out of it cuz we're human and we need to go through our process and not bypass our processes.
But I am fully in understanding of what is happening for me right now and what fears are being triggered and how to be gentle with. Myself and also my behaviors when I'm feeling vulnerable mm-hmm. Can come out onto other people. And when I'm starting to sense that, especially if somebody's kind of rubbing me the wrong way or they nick de wound or whatever, to kind of keep it in check a little bit.
But it's there. It's there cuz we're human beings with human experiences. And so sometimes the best leader you can be is first understanding how to lead yourself most effectively. And the Enneagram absolutely has provided me that. Oh my goodness. I give myself so much grace, but I also don't let myself off the hook.
Right? Yeah. With radical compassion. I love that radical compassion and that personal accountability. Totally. And, and this brings me, you know, one question I get a lot often, you know, before pandemic now with uncertainty is just how do I deal with conflict on a team? Mm-hmm. How do I manage, you know, getting people on the same page?
Mm-hmm. And I loved your episode, and I'll link to it in the show notes around this four C's framework that you share with teams. And I'd love for you to share that a little bit with the, with the audience. Well, you know, I'm somebody who's a very reactionary person naturally. Right, and you are too. And you know, having the pause button first, like even when things get heated, it's like, okay, get clarity really, really quickly.
And that's the first C, clarity. Clarity who's in front of me right now. Especially if they operate and behaviorally are shown up different than you. You need clarity of. What motivates this person? What fear is? Kind of when we have conflict, that's what's happening is everybody's in fear of some sort or control or they're not feeling seen, heard, understood, or valued.
Right? Yeah. So getting clarity of what's actually happening, not focusing on the behaviors, and immediately finding common ground and compassion. You don't have to like them. They could be. Behaving very poorly. Right? You know, whether it's a personal situation or a work situation, you don't have to like it, but you have to have compassion that obviously somebody's operating from a place of fear, insecurity, unworthiness, shame, guilt, and maybe even ego.
Those, the ego people are a little bit harder to find the compassion for. And as somebody who operates in a lot of ego, I understand that, but usually when the ego is coming out, it's a protective mechanism. Right. Yeah. And it's there to serve us. We don't always use it most effectively, but when, when you're seeing the fear and security unworthiness and guilt ego kind of pop up in their behaviors, like understand that this is a human being in front of you and try, the more that you can operate in compassion, the faster you will find that common ground.
And then when you operate in compassion, the walls come down a little bit faster. Mm-hmm. Now not for everyone, cuz people are in their own crap. Right, but the more that you can get to compassion faster, again, it's not letting people off the hook. It's not enabling, it's not, you know, cosigning their crap behavior or anything like that, but like, I understand you're human.
I understand you're upset and I want to find this common ground. That's how you're able to get to the Third Sea a lot faster, which is compromise. It doesn't mean you're always gonna agree, but whenever you know, you know this in a marriage like you and Wes, like you operate very, very differently. Right.
And you are gonna, yeah. And especially raising humans, my God, you have to compromise. Yeah, we can't always like be the right one. Yeah. Do we wanna be effective or do we wanna be Right? And this is where the compromise comes in. Yeah. And the more that you can operate in those first Cs, the first three Cs, clarity of who this person is, when you have clarity and they feel seen, heard, understood, and valued, like you're gonna get the walls coming down with compassion, then you can find the compromise and then you have to actually take compassionate corrective action.
Mm-hmm. And that's the fourth C. But you can't just bypass, like, let's take corrective action right now. We can't just bypass clarity and compassion and get to compromise because otherwise you're just putting a bandaid on something. Cuz sometimes we'll compromise just to, you know, keep the peace or get it over with or like, shut this person up.
But if you kind of skip the steps, you're gonna have. This reoccurring problem, whether it's with this person or another, right? Absolutely. So those Absolut, the faster you can kind of go through clarity, compassion, compromise to get to the compassionate corrective action, the faster you can move through conflict.
And here's the real truth, like avoiding conflict. You're really cutting off this great catalyst for change. Yeah, because it's in the conflict, it's in the crisis, it's in the things that go sideways that we. Get to experience the, the best growth as a personal person, as a professional person. And so, you know, this avoiding conflict, but navigating it is really where the secret sauce is to long-term growth and effective leadership for sure.
Yeah. And what a builder of psychological safety. I mean, as you called out. Yeah. We now we're able to have a framework for building that connection, demonstrating it's okay to make mistakes. I'm here, I'm able to take that perspective. I talk about this a lot with delivering feedback, especially difficult feedback.
As you said, you don't have to, it's not about like imagining how would I react? It's about how is that person feeling? Yeah. And having empathy for that. It's like, I don't care if you wouldn't be bothered by this piece of feedback. That's not who the feedback's for. No. So put like imagining this. Person and what they're going through and having that compassion.
This allows you to deliver a hard message and allows that person to see, oh wow, this person really gets it. They get that I'm disappointed that I didn't get this promotion. They get it. That I worked really hard, that I'm struggling with this skill. Like it's not about you as a man. Like what? What would happen?
And, and I think this is a huge shift that we really need to be making when managing teams. It's not just about applying. What would work for me And that is what the beauty of understanding of that there are different personalities out there. I think that's the first thing is like, oh wait, not everybody thinks like me.
And then understanding and sort of kind of getting that perspective around, well what is the composition of my team, of the leaders I'm trying to influence Managing up maybe of my. Of my partners, of my stakeholders, of my clients, all of that. So that you see, you know, hate to say it, you're not the center of the universe.
No. And, and you're gonna operate so much better when you can see, okay, yes, someone else is motivated by something different. Mm-hmm. And here is how I can make sure they feel seen. And when you operate from there, whether it's conflict or feedback or influencing, everything's gonna go so much more effectively.
I had a situation the other day. Where in any Gram two had to say something hard to me. He said, you know, I was offended that you said X, Y, Z to me. And you know, my natural tendency is to get defensive and cuz I'm super direct right by nature. But I was like, even though I am very motivated differently and fear differently, I'm like, ah, I can, I said, that absolutely was not my intent or my meaning and I can see why you felt that.
I can. Absolutely. So that getting the clarity that, oh shoot, I have an Enneagram too, of course. He needs to feel loved and appreciated. That's how he finds significance. What I said absolutely goes against that. And even though that was not my intent, by just saying, well, that wasn't my intent. Yeah, yeah.
But it's like, oh my gosh. Absolutely. I apologize. That wasn't my intent. And. Not, but, and I can see why you took it that way. Honestly. Like I will switch that language up and, and I see. And I also know where, why he was feeling extra sensitive, you know? And so using these four Cs to move through that, an Enneagram two, to come to an Enneagram eight and say something like that, like for him to feel brave enough to do that, cuz an it's nature is to.
Bite your head off. Right? And he just, he was like, yeah. And then he didn't harbo harp on it. He goes, I knew you would say that and I appreciate that, but it was bothering me and it was festering and I needed to say it to you. Boom. Moved through conflict within seconds. Yes. And everybody he felt seen, heard, understood, and valued and knows that I didn't just give him lip service.
I hear him and it won't happen again like that. Yeah. Just that first. Well, I love that. I mean, and this is how we make feedback a two-way street. Mm-hmm. Just as you called out, right? It's having saying, yes, I'm taking responsibility. And when you're a leader, When two things, when someone comes to you as Tracy called out, that's scary for that person Yes.
To come to their manager or someone senior to them, or someone in a position of power. Yes. So to recognize this person took a risk and they need to feel safe. And then two, to take responsibility when, when even if you are delivering feedback, you still have a role in it. If you're managing that person, maybe there was clarity you didn't share expectations that weren't as clear.
There was, you know, priorities shifted and, and people didn't really know what to focus on. So the more you take responsibility, now you're showing. We can move through this. I understand. You know, you're not like this problem thing that, that we have to figure out. So I really, I love that example for, for making feedback again, a two-way street for showing humility as a leader.
That's awesome. And it creates again, credibility and trust. Yeah. So that both cuz he has like, let me tell you, he's 25 years my junior and I learned more from him. Every single day. And because I took personal accountability with compassion, with empathy, it creates this beautiful opportunity to learn from each other.
Even though, yes, I am the, in the position of power and seniority, um, I humbled myself enough to say like, yeah, I, I was, I. Wrong in that, and I apologize and thank you for that. You're teaching me more compassion and empathy, which it's not my strength naturally, right? It's a learned thing that I'm continuously doing, and that credibility and trust is so valuable when it comes to leadership, and that's how you get the, the more bang for your buck.
And when, when you're working with teams that are lean right now, you have to be able to leverage. Every single person you have, we have to learn how to work with less. And so you have to make that less mean more, and that's how you build this is with earning this credibility and trust and really understanding people at their soul level this way, and that the Enneagram is my favorite tool in getting there faster.
Yes. Well, what a perfect place to wrap up. Yeah. Before we go, you know, is there something that you're working on that you're excited to share with our listeners? Honestly, I am, you know, team dynamics and understanding that people are having to work. Less look, work more with less. Yes. And that culture more than ever is so important.
And helping teams, even small lean teams, understanding who is in this, this trench with you, and understanding what motivates them and what. What fears each person and approaching it at this human level, even in the workplace, diving in with teams and creating this safe place, a psychological safety so that we can do what we're here to do and create and drive the bottom lines and the visions and, and everything that.
Your business is about in creating change. Working with teams like that is my favorite thing to do. Whether it's in like a mastermind, like, you know, we've done home teams, business teams, like making the most out of each person. That, and, and knowing that they're valuable and bring something to the table is my favorite, favorite thing to do every single day.
So if that's something you need for your home team or professional team, just reach out. Um, I can customize anything for you. Awesome. I love that. And folks, find you on your website, Instagram. Where's the best place to connect? Uh, my website is tracy O'Malley dot com. All the things are there. Instagram, I'm there, Tracy underscore O'Malley, LinkedIn, Facebook, all the things.
And the podcast lead with the agram. Honestly, that if you, if you're intrigued by this, um, definitely go check it out if you want to get an accurate assessment cuz they're inaccurate. 65 to 70% of the time I do offer. Um, those assessments that are accurate over 95%, and you get your own customized blueprint with all your framework, not just your type, but all the components that help make you the greatest of all time in your life.
Yes. I love that. Um, any parting words before we drop? Uh, just do better honestly. Yes. Like, just do better. Um, you know, the best leaders effectively lead themselves and you have that personal responsibility. With great reward comes great responsibility. So, uh, take the responsibility to know how other people might, um, receive you and work hard to be the best version of yourself on any given day.
And you will see the rewards come pouring in. Awesome. Thank you so much. And again, folks listening, I could not recommend doing the blueprint enough with Tracy and the partner session. I mean, literally transformational. And I think, you know, as Tracy called out, like Googling it and guessing at what it means for you, that's just not gonna get you anywhere.
That's gonna get you like all these new assumptions that make things maybe more complicated. So, Taking it and, and, and learning about yourself and then how you, that, how that type interacts with the people in your life. Yep. So that's really the differentiator I think for me was as we learned about, and in the blueprint, it has insight into all the nine types.
Now you switch the, oh, wait a second. Okay. I'm a three and I'm interacting with a nine or a. Seven. Now this is why we're getting stuck. Right? So this is the difference here is it's you first understand yourself, but then it, it, it's required to apply that. Well, how, how does that change the way I'm showing up?
Yeah. The information doesn't equal the transformation. It's the integration of it. So yeah. And I'm the, I'm the master guide in helping you integrate that in your life. So I'd be honored and privileged to do that with you. Yes. Awesome. Well, thank you. Thanks for having me on so much. Yeah. Thank you so much for being here.
This was such a fun conversation. My pleasure, babe. That's all I have for today. Thank you so much for tuning in to the Managing Made Simple Podcast where my goal is to demystify the job of people management so that together we can make the workplace somewhere everyone can thrive. I always love to hear from you, so please reach out at liagarvin.com or message me on LinkedIn.
See you next time.